Episode 99- Sofia Godoy, Etnica

Travel

Oct. 19

Travel is more than just a way to get from one place to another. It has the potential to be so much more and it can show us just how far we have come as humans but at the same time, travel also has an important role in our future journeys.

Traveling is truly an art. It can teach us so many things about humanity as a whole, one culture at a time.

Traveling is an integral part of the human experience. Whether it's to visit family, friends, or for a well-deserved vacation, it brings about an opportunity for reflection and self-discovery.

When many of us travel, there is a common idea that we will come back with a new understanding of other cultures. Have you ever wondered why it is that by being in another country we can have such a different view when in our own 'home'? It is true that traveling has the ability to give us an outside look at ourselves, our community, and the world around us.

If we are not intentional with this perspective, we can fall into the trap of assuming we know what life is like for others just because we are on their soil. This common misconception occurs by taking our own cultural values as an absolute set of truths rather than questioning them further through interaction with people who live in different conditions to ours.

Travel has long been a way to truly understand a country in a holistic way. In the same, being a traveler is not always easy and comes with risks, that's why Etnica has made it their mission to educate their clients on topics such as safe travel practices and empower local actors to operate off the beaten path and immersive community-based travel experiences.

The most valuable part of travel is not just the destination but rather the journey itself and by partnering with socially responsible tourism initiatives, travelers can make a positive impact on social justice and the communities where they operate.

Christine’s guest today is Sofía Godoy.

Sofía has a Bachelor's degree in Hotel and Restaurant Management and a Masters in Cultural Tourism. She made her way into the tourism industry, as she started working with different international DMC's as a freelance Group Tour Leader. This gave her experience in group travel, logistics and operations in Guatemala, Belice and Southern Mexico.

She is the Co-founder and Chief Operations Officer of Etnica, a Guatemalan based social enterprise; focused on responsible travel through community and immersive experiences.

In 2018, she was selected among 2000 applicants to participate in the Young Leaders of the Americas Initiative, a US State Dept. sponsored program for entrepeneurs from Latin America and the Caribbean. In 2021, Sofía and the Etnica team were among the winners of the UNWTO's Global Startup Competition for their contribution to the SDG's. Sofía is very passionate about sharing the richness, heritage and culture of Guatemala. In her spare time, Sofia enjoys writing, hiking and birdwatching.

In this conversation, Christine and Sofía talk about travel being a way to truly understand a country in a holistic way. The importance in taking time to understand where you are traveling, and the ways we can connect social impact and community led tourism in anti oppression while creating deep and meaningful connections.

Join Christine for her soulful conversation with Sofía Godoy.

In this episode, Christine and Sofía discuss:

How travel found Sofía and the impact its had on her life
Why travel is a way to truly understand a country in a holistic way
The importance in taking time to understand where you are traveling
The ways we can connect, social impact and community led tourism in anti-oppression while creating deep and meaningful connections
How the “coffee tour” in Guatemala came about
Why it’s so important to have conversations with locals
The importance of connecting tourists with women’s projects
How to tell the full story of Guatemala’s infrastructure

Resources & Links Mentioned in the Episode

Learn more about Sofía Godoy and Etnica, head over to https://www.etnicatravel.com/

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WE WON A BESSIE AWARD! The Bessie Awards recognize the achievements of women and gender-diverse people making an impact in the travel industry. To view the complete list of this year’s winners, visit bessieawards.org.

About the Soul Of Travel Podcast

Soul of Travel honors the passion and dedication of the people making a positive impact in tourism. In each episode, you’ll hear the story of women who are industry professionals and seasoned travelers and community leaders who know travel is more than a vacation. It is an opportunity for personal awareness and it is a vehicle for change. We are thought leaders, action takers, and heart-centered change makers.

The guests work in all sectors of the tourism industry. You'll hear from adventure-based community organizations, social impact businesses, travel photographers and videographers, tourism boards and destination marketing organizations, and transformational travel experts. They all honor the idea that travel is more than a vacation and focus on sustainable travel, eco-travel, community-based tourism, and intentional travel.

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If you want to learn about new destinations, types of travel, or how to be more intentional or live life on purpose, join Christine Winebrenner Irick for soulful conversations with her community of fellow travelers exploring the heart, the mind, and the globe. These conversations highlight what tourism really means for the world.

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Credits. Christine Winebrenner Irick (Host, creator, editor.) Sofía Godoy (Guest). Original music by Clark Adams. Editing and production by Rayna Booth.

Transcript

KEYWORDS

Guatemala, travel, travelers, trips, people, community, tourism, conversations, women, create, experience, support, connect, guides, country, destination, coffee, opportunity, share

Christine Winebrenner Irick 00:08

Thank you for joining me for soulful conversations with my community of fellow travelers, exploring the heart, the mind and the globe. These conversations highlight what travel really means for the world. Soul of Travel honors the passion and dedication of the people making a positive impact in tourism. Each week, I'll be speaking to women who are tourism professionals, world travelers and leaders in their communities will explore how travel has changed them and how that has rippled out and inspired them to change the world. These conversations are as much about travel as they are about passion, and living life with purpose, chasing dreams, building businesses, and having the desire to make the world a better place. This is a community of people who no travel is more than a vacation. It is an opportunity for personal awareness, and it is a vehicle for change. We are thought leaders, action takers, and heart centered change makers I'm Christine Winebrenner Irick. And this is the Soul of Travel.

Sophia Godoy is the Co-Founder and Chief Operations Officer at Etnica, a Guatemalan based social enterprise focused on responsible travel through community and immersive experiences. In 2018. She was selected among 2000 applicants to participate in the young leaders of America's Initiative, a US State Department sponsored program for entrepreneurs from Latin America and the Caribbean. In 2021, Sofia and that Etnica team were among the winners of the UNWTO global startup competition for their contribution to the SDGs. In our conversation, Sophia talks about travel being a way to truly understand a country in a holistic way. The importance of taking time to understand where you are traveling, and the ways we can connect social impact community led tourism in anti oppression while creating deep and meaningful connections.

Join me now for my soulful conversation with Sophia Godoy.

I am so happy today to be sitting down with Sophia Godoy, who's joining us from Guatemala. Sophia is the Co-Founder and Chief Operations Officer at Etnica, which is a Guatemalan based social enterprise focused on responsible travel. And I am just so excited to get to bring you on and share all of the things that are your specialty. So many of them are things that I'm really passionate about as well. And we've been so lucky to have some really beautiful conversations already. So I'm happy to be able to let our listeners into this experience today.

03:28

Thank you so much, Christina and listeners, thank you so much for the space. I'm very happy to be able to share a little bit of my experience here in Guatemala and in the travel industry in general. So I'm very excited for our conversation today.

Christine Winebrenner Irick 03:41

Thank you. And Sophia and I were connected through the rise travel Institute when she was presenting her capstone project, I immediately had ears perking up and sent an email straightaway to connect. Because, one, I have such a deep love of Guatemala and like I said many of the things that we're both so passionate about in the space of travel, I just knew that it would be a real soulful connection. So I know that Rise will probably be sprinkled in throughout this conversation as well. And I just can't wait to start digging in. So let's start by giving you the opportunity to introduce yourself and tell us just a little bit about who you are in the space of travel right now.

04:31

When they're full. So I was born and raised here in Guatemala. My background is actually hospitality. I studied hospitality when I was in college. And that was my first approach to the tourism industry here in Guatemala. different paths in life brought me to work exclusively in tourism. Once I graduated college, I started working on a local tour operator in Guatemala in operations. So I was able to get my first close up to community tourism which is What we do here at Etnica, what we promote. However, the company I was working for was not entirely focused on community tourism as their main product.

Guatemala has different segments when it comes to travel, weddings, conventions are some of the biggest even cruises doesn't make much sense considering that community tourism has such a strong presence, you know, it's pretty much all over the country. So this was my first close up to tourism, I got really curious into what community and cultural tourism was. And I had the opportunity of doing a Master's in cultural tourism.

I was able to go to Spain and study abroad. However, I definitely wanted to come back to Guatemala and start doing something here. As soon as it came back, I started working as a tour leader for intrepid travel, I also worked for flashback and for another company focused on student travel called Explorer is give me my first experience leading tour groups in trouble being a responsible travel company also will open my eyes into this segment that is so rewarding.

However, I wanted to do things a bit differently, you know, considering group travel can sometimes be a little bit more complex, and it's fast paced, you know, so you don't have a lot of time to like, actually slow down and observe the destination, reflect on the activities. So definitely wanting to do it a bit different when you can do it Etnica, our main goal, when we started the company in 2016, with Pablo, my partner was supporting artisans. No, because one thing that I noticed during my experience in tourism is that a lot of travelers come here to Guatemala to experience and learn how crafts and textiles are made. It's very different, difficult to separate those segments here, when it comes to travel.

So we definitely want it to create more meaningful interactions and to foster deeper connections with these local actors that sometimes were not receiving the entire benefit of the amount of tourists that were visiting them, you know, you would see a lot of groups coming in, but the communities were not evolving, you know, you could see that there wasn't a major impact. So we definitely wanted to do it differently. We started with five communities here in Guatemala, where we met our first artisan partners. And it was definitely an integration process that took us about a year of research. You know, gaining our partners trust us to trust them as well, you know, and to establish a mutually beneficial relationship, because it has to be a win-win for everybody.

When we say that we're a social enterprise, we're still an enterprise, you know, so it definitely has to be an effort on both ends. It was a wonderful process where we learned a lot. So we started with an E commerce platform where we're supporting artisans in selling their products. And as we started growing, it started evolving. And we had people reach out that wanted to come here to learn textiles, you know, and they wanted to learn ceramics or they wanted to take an art class. And then it started evolving even more.

And we started connecting to other different experiences, discovering other community tourism projects that were not entirely focused on the artisan sector, maybe they were more focused on conservation, or on education. So definitely, that opened up an entirely new world for us and the guy evolved into what we know today. So I'm no longer leading group travel for other DMCs. I'm focused entirely 100% on Ethics. And it's been a wonderful journey for us creating new partnerships.

Last year, we won the UNWTO global startup competition for the SDGs because our business model is focused on breaking the cycle of poverty through travel. So that definitely skyrocketed us even more, which was very motivating after the pandemic. So here we are today. still growing.

Christine Winebrenner Irick 08:48

Yeah, congratulations on receiving that, and for the recognition for the work that you're doing. That, you know, like I mentioned, that's definitely what really resonated with me. And as I would travel, I always found myself kind of seeking these experiences looking for artisans, I could connect with looking for ways to engage with social impact projects or to be connected to community and really starting to look at, you know, how travel could be more impactful if we use those points of connection to create our travel experiences. And I love that, you know, you started working with artisans, but then that kind of widened as you've learned the other ways that you could engage and connect.

And I think what I love about the journeys that you create is that there are really holistic examinations of the destination of Guatemala to invite travelers really into that conversation. And using these experiences as not just learning about ceramics per se, but to learn about what that means to the community who support it, there's all these other pieces. And one of the examples that you have shared with me in the past was the coffee tour that you did. That kind of is an example of a circular economy and Guatemala. I would love for you to share how that experience came about and what it looks like and why that's important to bring travelers into understanding Guatemala.

10:24

Well, definitely, I think what we do is that we want to visualize these initiatives, you know, because it's not something that we can entire without we can take credit for these projects came up as a necessity to tackle the social injustice and oppressive dynamics that have happened here in what Amala as a developing country, and in the case of coffee, it is one of the biggest exports here in Guatemala, you know, what among coffee is top notch, super, super good.

However, agriculture is not a dignified job as it should be. So one of our partners is Delahanty, which is a nonprofit that is based in the outskirts of Antigua, Guatemala, and it is very famous for its high altitude coffee. The region in general, you know, we've been so fertile with volcanoes around. It's something that a lot of watermelons are dedicated to. However, they face a lot of barriers when it comes to commercializing their product, taking it abroad, where their actual consumers are found. So this nonprofit is focused on creating economic opportunities for farmer comparatives from the village of Samuel Escobar.

And they found community tourism to be a bridge for development for them as well, you know, not only support them in getting their product out there, but being able to share it on like the large coffee tours where you go to a plantation and they're a bit more superficial because you're only like in a little track Dory and you get a demonstration of the how this process goes. However, in the Land Day, you do this hand by hand with a local farmer, you walk to the coffee fields with the farmers, you go to their house to learn the entire artisan process, because original coffee was not processed using heavy machinery, it was something that was entirely done by hand using a grinding stone, you know, people will roast the coffee on the roof of their houses. So, this coffee tour is very, very special, you know, because from the moment you get to Antigua, you start supporting that portion of the entire economy of the village.

The driver that will pick you up is from somebody else, she will take you back to the to the village where you will meet the farmers, you will do the entire coffee demonstration and tour with the farmers you will come back to their houses where the entire family participates, you know you will walk with the farmer to the fields and he will share all of you know his identity, the coffee culture that they have. But when you come back, his wife is going to be probably the one that's going to teach you how to grind the How to grind the coffee, how to use the grinding stone. And the family will also prepare lunch for the travelers.

Definitely lunches prepared with ingredients that they source locally and the translators that are part of the trip that are also helping with the language barrier are also locals. So definitely you are already supporting a circular economy system. All of the money that is going into the store is staying in San Miguel Escobar, you also get a complimentary coffee, one pound to take back with you. They also do cooking classes where you can take the recipe back with you. So it's very valuable because this is something that travelers can still support once they're back home.

For example, this nonprofit allows you to subscribe to a coffee service that they have even when you're in the States or anywhere in the world, you can still continue to receive your coffee. So we find this experience very valuable unlike any other coffee tours because it allows travelers to create a deeper connection . Now they know what is behind their coffee cup from bean to cup. And why it is so special. Why is it so important? And I guess ultimately, this also empowers travelers to make more conscious consumption decisions in the end, you know, like maybe after this coffee tour, they will buy their coffee from a large corporation but they will look more into fairtrade coffee.

Christine Winebrenner Irick 14:17

Yeah, thank you for sharing that. And I, the part of it that sticks out for me is just imagining myself walking with that farmer to the field. Because those are the moments for me that I find I'll really hang on to after I travel anyway so I can feel myself leaning into that. And just really the value of being able to spend time with someone in their space and have them tell you and share their story. I think that's so powerful for the traveler and for the person that is leading the tour or sharing their life experience with you.

And like you've said, just allowing travelers to learn something about something that they probably interact with Every day, without thinking about how it arrived at their home, it really changes the context of that. And I think it's such a powerful experience. You mentioned, that part of the process of your trips is really showing travelers, you know, all the parts of Guatemala, I think when we think about travel, we were thinking about only, you know, visiting beautiful beaches, or maybe seeing museums or highlights of a country, but we're not really committed to fully understanding where we are and what it's like to live there.

And I love that the trips that you create are not just education for travelers, but they're really like education in action, and you are showing travelers what gentrification and mass tourism impact in your country, you're showing them how some travel practices actually support oppression in a country. But you're doing it in a way that like, almost they can discover it. It's not, I don't know, it's just such a really valuable practice. But why is this so important to you? And how do you do this? How do you start to tell this full story of your country? Well,

16:19

I think it definitely depends on the first approach that we have from our customers and travelers, you know, a lot of them have gone through popular travel blogs, or you know, travel guides, that will lead them in the direction of visiting the conventional destinations, which is fine, you know, it's difficult to shift people's people want to travel because they want to be happy, you know, they want to have these memories, and they have their interest. However, we definitely suggest these type of activities, you know, and give them further information about why they are so special, you know, when it comes to families, for example, why it is so special to take a cooking class with a local family, if you're traveling with your kids, for example, this can create a space for cultural exchange.

And we really want to highlight the benefits that go both ways. You know, it goes both ways for local hosts, and for the travelers that are coming here. Ultimately, when you choose to travel in a more ethical way, you are going to be happier, and you are going to feel more rewarded. However, there are so many things beyond what your eye can see, when you come here to a place, we're definitely focused on being very transparent. You know, what Amala is a developing country, and it has so many complexities, that even though it is a very highly friendly tourist destination, there are some things that are pretty mind blowing, once you're here, you know, there's so much inequality, and you can see it in the travel destinations as well.

You know, there we have very poor development indexes as a country, malnutrition is skyrocketing in comparison to other countries in the Americas. And, for example, one of my lives is super productive. There's so much abundance. So a lot of people don't actually question that when they're traveling, why is there so much poverty when there is so much productivity, and then that's when corruption comes in, and how it is affecting it's even affecting the travel industry, because there is no much investment in infrastructure. So tourism is here as an act of resistance, especially community tourism, because we're working against everything that's going against us, you know, bad infrastructure, political instability, however, we're still able to keep a fully thriving tourism industry.

And this thing's to the local communities, you know, and it's very valuable for travelers to see that, especially when you come to destinations that are so popular on its own, for example, like Antigua, which is incredibly gentrified right now, but the majority of people aren't noticing that, you know, once you move to the outskirts of Antigua and do a tour, for example, like the copywriter shared with you or an experience with weavers or visit a market outside of a diva, then that's, that's even more eye opening. So we definitely do try to provide as much context as possible and not sugarcoat things. We definitely want to empower travelers to move around on their own.

So we are super detailed in following them around their journey. We connect with our customers and travelers through an app where they have direct chat with our team the entire time. We give them all the necessary suggestions and recommendations for them to also make the most of their experience on their own. But I think a very valuable part of what we do here, Etnica. Our local guides and local guides are the ones that are able to share this context in depth. And that also applies to local hosts. You know, when you go to a community tourism project on your own, you're able to learn from the people that are behind this, why they wanted to do this and how it is changing their lives.

Christine Winebrenner Irick 19:48

Yeah, I think one of the things is so important, like you said, is when you are working with local guides, doing homestays and connecting with people and communities that engage in meaningful conversation and asking questions. I think there's something that we resist typically in those situations, I think maybe even understanding that there is so much oppression than politics, the political discord and all that, that maybe we feel like it's inappropriate to ask questions or to get that, that understanding of the context. But really, once you start having those conversations, you realize that people really are eager to share and to converse and to talk about things. And we don't have to kind of worry about being overly sensitive. And I think, you know, it's always good to understand where or where not to have some sensitive conversations. But for the most part, I have found that people really want to share openly about their experiences.

20:52

And that's exactly where you find common ground. You know, like when you're thinking about those questions, for I will give you an example for a homestay, where you have a language barrier. And I don't know if you have someone with an entirely different background, and staying here with a family that has an entirely different background. But through asking those questions, you will find common ground, you know, and that's where you can foster a more even meaningful connection with the person. So I think that's the most valuable, we definitely encourage travelers to ask as many questions as possible, because that's also motivating for the local partners that we have here. You know, it's showing that the traveler is interested in their identity and their story and why they're doing this and who they are. And that's definitely another point in favor of why they should keep doing this.

Christine Winebrenner Irick 21:43

We mentioned the rice course that you were a part of. And I know that you ended up working with the rise team to create a pre trip destination course that really helps to create that level of in depth context before travelers come to the country. Why was that important for you to get involved in? And what does that offer travelers, if people are looking for having a greater understanding before they traveled to the country?

22:11

Well, our partnership with the rice travel Institute has been definitely very rewarding for us. And something unlike any other local partnership that we could have found here. The program that they have for education in sustainability, and anti oppression is fantastic. And I took the program in 2021.

22:34

Obviously, not as a world traveler, because I'm not as well traveled, as a lot of my peers were. However, I did have a lot of experience moving around with groups, you know, and I noticed that these conversations needed to happen, you know, I saw a lot of travelers that what the mullah would hit them in the face as soon as they would come, you know, there's culture shock, there's so many things that you want to question. And there's not a space for you to question them or to dig deep into them, and why you're feeling the way you're feeling. And being able to connect with rice and see how there are more people interested in this was wonderful for us at Nika. During my capstone project, I was able to present different initiatives and projects here in Guatemala that would align perfectly to the topics that we were discussing on the course.

So it was really good for me to be able to share this. And that's where the opportunity for the destination course came. The destination course is focused on providing social, historical, cultural and political context on Guatemala. It's brief, because obviously, there's so much to share. But we definitely wanted to wrap it up in a way that wasn't too overwhelming, and would still motivate travelers to come here. Because even with all the beauties that we have here, the complexities and the issues that we watermelons face on a daily basis are very harsh, just like any other developing country, you know, but Guatemala just got out of the Civil War, when you consider it, we were in a civil war for 36 years from 1960 to 1996. It wasn't very far, long ago that it ended. So we're still seeing the impact of that migration. Even though travel, the travel industry is still getting stronger.

A lot of people are still leaving their villages because of the lack of decent job opportunities. So there are definitely a lot of layers that come into trouble that travelers can support and make better choices to, you know, counter these unfortunate things that are affecting rural Guatemala. Mostly, you know, it's a very unequal country. So the course for us was an opportunity to share our experience, you know, and well, how Guatemala unfolds as a competitive travel destination in spite of all of these issues. So even though me and Pablo Who are giving who are the instructors for their scores, we are sharing our position and our perspectives from a position of privilege.

And we're perfectly aware of that. We had the opportunity of going abroad and studying outside of Guatemala and oxygen superior education, which is something that the majority of Guatemalans aren't able to do. So for us, it's very important to be able to share things exactly as they are. We're not going to sugarcoat that things in Guatemala are wonderful. You know, we are the land of eternal spring, but things are not always blooming, wonderful here. So it's definitely very important that travelers know where they are, you know, and what things are acceptable and which ones are not like something very simple, like going to the market, and bargaining can contribute so much to poverty and to extinction of culture. And travelers don't know that because they will pick up a travel guide. And the first advice they're going to have on the planet is, oh, make sure to haggle.

Never play Never pay full price. It's a cultural thing. It's not. It's not in the end, you know, and it 's contributing to so many social injustices that mostly affect women and young children, which are the majority of the population here. So for us, it definitely is very important, were very grateful to have the opportunity of having this course, with the experiential journey that we hosted with the rise travel Institute, we visited 12 different community tourism projects, it was very intensive, fast paced, however, I was very lucky to be a part of the tour and be a local host. And I definitely did see how rewarding these trips can be. You know, the group was very much engaged, everybody had taken the course before. So they had a prior knowledge of what they were coming to, you know, and that allowed the experiences to be even more thoughtful, because everybody was so engaged with asking questions, they had prior knowledge of what some of the projects were focused on. So that allowed the trip to be even more seamless.

And, for me, it was wonderful, you know, in comparison to other group trips that I've led, everybody had the same mindset, everybody had the same goals of learning. So it was unlike any other trip I led, we are definitely pushing our customers to take the course as well, because it will prepare them even more for their trip, they're going to come even more excited, because they already have prior knowledge. And that makes it even more rewarding for the local hosts, like for the local guy that is giving you a walking tour on the Antigua you already know a little bit of the history, so the conversation is gonna evolve even more.

Christine Winebrenner Irick 27:28

Yeah, I love it, it just creates that, like you said, that deep connection before you even travel. So then once you get there, you're not really superficially engaging with the destination or people, you can really step into meaningful conversations and really begin to learn more, and then your experiences become even richer because you have this understanding. And I think you move through a space so differently, when you are more aware and more comfortable. And just.

And then for me, in particular, to be able to travel with a community of travelers like that would be so powerful, because that's how I always want to engage and talk and connect. And often, you know, like you said, people aren't, aren't coming from that space, you don't usually have such a group that's so connected in one mission and one way of thinking and an understanding and what they're there for. So I love that. And I also love that you're encouraging travelers who are coming to Guatemala to take that program.

I offer a trip to Guatemala, and I will definitely build that into my offering and encourage my travelers to take it as well. Because I think it's a bit of our personal personal responsibility when we travel somewhere to know about where we're going. And, you know, it doesn't like you said, it's not a huge course. But I think it's just really important to know about where you're traveling and why you're traveling. And then it just creates a larger space for it to be an impactful trip, as well.

29:05

Absolutely. And it can apply to any style of travel here. You know, you don't have to come to Milan to focus 100% on community tourism, you can combine it with other experiences of your interest. However, it will definitely make it more rich, like you mentioned, you know, you won't come here entirely blindfolded because we get that, you know, in the end, there's travelers and there's tourists, you know, there are some that come here and it's like they forget absolutely everything they've experienced in their other trips. And it's okay, you know, because not everybody is prepared or educated in the ways of responsible travel. But having this insight will definitely empower them to be more self aware. And call their trip is impacting Guatemala in general and how it's impacting on a personal level as well.

Christine Winebrenner Irick 29:54

Yeah, that's one thing that I really would love to emphasize. This seems like it's so much about the engagement with Guatemala and understanding Guatemala, but I think really what you will learn is a lot about yourself, because you will understand how you have seen the world and engage with the world and things that you just didn't know about who you are and your own identity. And that becomes, I think, a really powerful part of the process as well. Yes, it's gonna

30:23

change in the end, the way that you travel in general, you know, Guatemala might be a starting point, or it might be you're in a third country, but it's definitely gonna evolve how you're going to travel in the future. And we've seen that like, with the people that come here and take like, in depth trips that are more slow paced, they will come back next, you know, already more prepared, and more interested in experiencing another part of Guatemala, because even though we're such a small country, there's so much richness here. It's so culturally diverse, so geographically diverse as well in such a small territory. So it's definitely worth experiencing at a slow pace, and I think that the people that are able to do that are very lucky.

Christine Winebrenner Irick 31:06

Yes, yeah. Very lucky. I mean, it's been one of the most impactful destinations for me personally. So I just, whenever anyone mentions that they're curious about traveling there, I am, like, yes, if Guatemala told you to come, you should go. Because that was my experience, it just kept telling me to come. And when I arrived there, I really understood what that invitation was about. And it was such a powerful experience.

And you mentioned Guatemala being an overwhelming experience and needing kind of time to reflect and integrate. I know, for me, that was really important and not so much for, you know, things that you might see that you aren't used to in terms of poverty, or culture shock. But for me, it was like, my level of personal awareness and spirituality were really like, awakened during this trip. And for me, that was what was really powerful. And I just needed space to be with that. And I think that when you're guiding travelers, and you know, you can share how this is for you.

But when you're working with travelers, knowing that you're in a place that is going to evoke so much emotion, like a wide variety of motion for your travelers, how do you create space for that, because I think that's something that's newer to the travel industry is reflecting on what you're experiencing, while you're experiencing it, creating space for that creating space for more in depth conversations, and not just plowing through everything that's on your bucket list, or everything that you want to experience? How do you create that for your travelers?

32:50

Well, I definitely agree, this is something relatively new, like, I'm not going to lie when I was leading trips. For other companies, this wasn't a goal of mine, you know, like, I would notice that some people were struggling, but I would relate it more to maybe like group dynamics, you know, because you have so many different personalities, people with different interests, and that's definitely a part of group travel. So I wouldn't see it as a necessity, until I actually started leading these trips for ethnic, that were with a purpose, you know, and more education.

And definitely the being, taking the rice being part of the rice pilot program was definitely shifting for me as well. You know, as I was going through the different lessons from the wonderful instructors, I was like, Oh, my God, this would have been so, so useful. When I was living this trip, you know, this person was struggling. Like, I didn't know that these spaces were necessary mental now. So definitely, you want to employ them and apply them to our trips as they go.

I think having a local host and a leader is definitely necessary for these spaces, you know, because you cannot expect like a family to sit the travelers on their own to like, sit down at the end of the day and talk about this, like, how are you feeling and all that I think this is something that has to be done by the local guides, because they're able to provide some perspective on how things are here and why they are like that, you know, and provide a little bit more clarity. Because there are some things here in Guatemala that will definitely break your heart, you know, so being able to understand why they are there, why things are the way they are and why we are in this situation currently, right now. Having local input is very, very valuable.

So for us having those spaces is done through clear communication. And you know, we're available even for travelers that are on their own. We're available 24/7 They have direct chat with our team, they're able to call us so we can provide more insight on that. But since we're not always on the field, it's definitely up to the local guides. And that's why it's so valuable for us to employ local guides, you know, a lot of travelers don't want to support local guides, because they believe that it's like an extra expense or that they will be able to figure out the experience on their own. And definitely not, you know, there's so much more that goes into this experience, when you hire a guide, you're gonna get the full experience. And in the end, you're also supporting the local economy, because the local guides are from there, they have been there their entire life.

And a lot of them are even self taught. And they've gone through a certification process that is very demanding, sometimes a little bit frustrating. So for them, for you to be able to support someone that has their guide credential is wonderful, because you know that this person has taken the time to become an expert, and to share this information in an accurate way. So definitely, these spaces are done with the guides and with the trip leaders. And they will adapt to the type of group you know, if it's teenagers that are here for an educational purpose, it's absolutely mandatory, you know, and also for the parents, for example, to be able to see the different experiences that their kids are engaging in, and how this will allow them to experience the world in a different way. So definitely, it's up to the guy.

Christine Winebrenner Irick 36:15

Yeah, and I think, for people listening, if you haven't traveled with a local guy before that, it will really shift the way you travel forever. Like, it's really, really amazing to be able to have that interaction. And especially in Guatemala, where if you're going from one place to another, it usually takes quite a bit of time to get from one place to another. And so that space traveling together with that guide, again, there's just more space for conversation and what you're noticing out the window or just asking questions that you might have, it just creates such a rich experience versus just, you know, driving in a rented car with your family or riding on the bus or something, I just, I really encourage people if you haven't done that, to try that, well, I really wanted to start to talk about the women's trips that you have been working on. Obviously, my listeners know that supporting women's social impact projects and connecting with women and artisans, is what I'm all about.

That's what I've always gravitated towards in travel. But I began to understand the impact travel has when you intentionally support women, and really then starting to understand the role that women play in communities, it became more valuable for me. And you and I have talked about how women are the keepers of culture and how travel can really help to step in and help create more value for preserving that culture. And also, I know that we both see, you know, women rising and overcoming oppression with limited access to education or jobs, and tourism really allows them to kind of get inventive and creative and how they can step into those roles. So I would love to talk about some of your itineraries, and then also really like the importance of connecting tourists with women's projects and women as they travel through a destination.

38:17

Well, the majority of our partners here in Guatemala, our women, we work with about 60% of women weavers from different indigenous ethnicities. Textiles are such a strong part of the the identity of my women here in Guatemala, you know, as I mentioned, it's already an act of resistance when they're continuing to protect and practice these artisan traditions with globalization and you know, and fast fashion and plagiarism and disregard of intellectual property playing against them. And access to education in general. You know, the majority of the population here are women. And the majority of young girls are not even able to finish school, they get pulled out of school, because obviously Guatemala is a very patriarchal society where it's thought that the woman is supposed to take care of the family, and, you know, cater to the men from a very young age. So a lot of our partners weren't even able to finish school, you know, they got pulled out at a very young age to start working. They start learning how to weave when they're seven years old, which is something amazing in the end, you know, because they were their traditional garments.

So proudly, it takes so much to make one piece following a very intricate process. And all of them are so different. All the different textile traditions here in Guatemala are different in such a small territory. So we definitely wanted to highlight that here at ethnic as one of our main purposes, the idea of starting this women's trip is for women to empower women, you know that that is the goal because it's going to come both ways. So we are working on some very intended itineraries that are focused on only supporting projects that are led by women. Women are the backbone of the home here, you know, they're expected to take care of their kids, they're expected to work. And they're expected to keep the household together in general. And they do it, you know, they do it, they're able to do it with everything playing against them.

So for us, it's very valuable, to allow them to share their voices, you know, and to be able to share with travelers, a little bit of their background as well, you know, because there's so much to tell, there's so much stories for them to tell why they are doing what they're doing. So these trips are going to be group trips, you know, they're going to be open for women from anywhere that wants to come here, it's going to be small group travel, though. And they're going to be led by one of our local hosts that is a certified guide and woman as well. And they are going to be focused on community tourism experiences, they're going to combine a little bit of leisure, obviously, you're going to come here to Guatemala and there are some places that you cannot miss out on. But we are going to combine those destinations, where it's some very meaningful experiences focused on agricultural tourism, you know, use of medicinal plants. Midwives are a very strong part of watermelon identity.

The majority of babies here in Guatemala are born with the support of Acoma, Verona, a midwife. And the use of medicinal plants is very important as well, you know, in rural Guatemala, Western medicine is not the first option. It's traditional medicine, you know, and this is something that is very, very strong and very, very rooted into the identity of women and people in general, especially when you actually learn the background of midwives that don't even charge for their services, you know, this is a voluntary service that they offer their community. So there are so many things to discover there.

And we are combining all of these in an adventure for women to come learn from other women who you will find common ground with just from these conversations, you know, but they are going to be some very hands on experiences, you're going to be able to learn from the midwives, about the medicinal plants, how to manufacture some of the products that they make by hand, that are focused on wellness medicine as well. We're going to have some natural dyes, workshops with women as well. And we're going to do some cooking classes. And they're going to be led entirely by female guides. So even when we do like archeological stones, or something that is a little bit more specialized, it's going to be with women.

Christine Winebrenner Irick 42:34

amazing. I'm so excited, I feel like yeah, everything that you just mentioned is exactly what I would want from a travel experience. But I think, again, it's just so important to bring women into those conversations. And like you said that the Equal Exchange that happens too, I think, I have been lucky to witness some of those conversations and where the the women that I've brought as travelers walk away, not realizing how much they were going to get out of that interaction, like they expected to maybe learn something or, you know, just, you know, learn how to do something or watch something more cultural, that they didn't expect such a deep personal connection, or to learn something so profound about themselves through another woman's story, especially a woman in Guatemala that maybe they wouldn't think they would be able to connect with.

And like you said, I think that's just where the real power of these kinds of experiences are, is being able to find that common ground amongst all of these things that seems so far apart. And I think that's where travel has this beautiful power to create connection, and to start to overcome some of these things that we're seeing in the world. And so I'm really excited for you to begin to offer those trips. And,

43:56

You know, we're very happy for 2023. Travel is definitely starting to react slowly here. So we're feeling very positive that we're going to have a good response. And in the end, we're just so motivated to be able to share the resilience that these women have, you know, because I was mentioning a lot of them weren't able to finish school. But when you look at what they're doing, they have kids that are already attending college. You know, education is a privilege here, it's not a right. So it's wonderful to see how they have been due to their hard work, you know, and resistance and being the keepers of their culture. They're still able to provide better opportunities for their kids. So that's definitely something that motivates Yeah,

Christine Winebrenner Irick 44:38

It's amazing. And witnessing that power is something really special and that drive and to see the change that's being made even in one generation of women and a family. Like you mentioned, it's I don't it's something special to be able to be a part of that and I'm so grateful when I've been able to travel there to be invited into seeing that and I hope that travel There's that travel with you through the way that you share the country will understand what that kind of connection means that that in itself is not a, you know, is a privilege is not something we should expect.

And it's just something really powerful to treasure. Before we end our conversation, I want to talk a little bit about some of the other things that you have coming up, I know that you're working on something that's called travel gear for good. And I know you're also looking at moving into Mexico as well. So I would love to just hear like a little highlights of those projects. So that trap or people know what to look forward to.

45:39

Thank you, Christine. Yes, we're very excited. Well, travel gear for good, is a project that we started in 2019, late 2019. So we're going full throttle. In 2020, we got a grant from the US State Department. I participated in an entrepreneurship scholarship. And we were able to access a grant for the development of a handmade collection of travel accessories. We were doing it in collaboration with artists and partners from Lake Atitlan, using natural fibers and natural dyes. So we started with our first prototypes, which were very successful, but then COVID came. So we definitely had to put the project on pause. It is one of our main goals for 2023, to be able to launch our E commerce as part of our website, to be able to share different travel accessories, you know, not only for travelers that are visiting Guatemala in the future, but for anybody that wants to get them at home, you know, we are going to fall we are following a fair trade model when it comes to this and we're giving credit to the maker.

Absolutely. When you purchase a pouch or a scarf, or any of the products that we're designing, you're going to be able to see who is making the product, you know, and who you are supporting directly. So this is also a way for us to support our partners, because not everybody has the opportunity of coming to what Amala you know, but handmade products are, they have a very big demand, especially since people are now more conscious in what they're buying. So we are finishing curating our collection. And our ultimate goal is to be able to source artisan products from the different countries where we're going to be working. So the next step is going to be Mexico.

Well, my partner and co-founder Pablo is also Mexican. And the spark that ignited at Nika as an idea was actually when he was doing his thesis in southern Mexico in Chiapas, and Wahaca. With artisans. So we found an opportunity right now, to expand our operations to southern Mexico, we're going to be relocating temporarily, to start operations there, we're in the process of creating our tourism product, definitely with community tourism as a goal, which is wonderful, because this is going to give us the opportunity to connect Guatemala to other markets that are not able to visit here. With so many infrastructure issues that we have here in Guatemala connectivity is very poor. You know, there are a lot of people that are not able to visit Amala because there's not many direct flights from Europe or from cities in the states, which are main markets. But being present in Mexico will allow us to connect it to Amala as well, because there are some low cost flights that are now available to connect what Amala to Wahaca, to connect it to Japan, to Yucatan, and to Cancun as well.

And these airports are definitely larger than Guatemala. So we will see this, we see this as an opportunity to be able to connect to markets that we had no idea we're up there. So we're excited. Mexico has a fantastic offer, we both have experience already there, me working as a tour leader. So there is definitely already a sense of belonging that is definitely necessary if we want to do this. There are so many cool community tours and projects that are already organized and working and thriving wonderfully. How America will provide them more visibility, and you know, we'll be able to connect them to more countries, travelers, like the ones that we welcome here. And it's very exciting, because we're going to be able to offer longer trips, you know, you know, offer Mexico and offer an add on to what Amala and vice versa, which will ultimately spark more slow travel and, you know, meaningful travel. So, you will find us in southern Mexico starting next year.

Christine Winebrenner Irick 49:42

Excellent. Thank you for sharing that. It's so exciting. And yeah, again, just like the opportunity, you said to move slowly through both of those regions and then to be able to compare and contrast and get to understand an even greater sense of being in both of those places. I think that that will offer travelers a really powerful experience. So I'm excited to see what you are creating. Well as we wrap up, can you just tell Sofia how people can find you if they want to connect with you and travel with Etnica?