Episode 101 - Mehgan Heaney-Grier, The Imperfect Conservationist

Travel

Nov. 2

Healthy oceans and marine ecosystem services are the foundation for an ocean economy, providing crucial supporting functions on which human health and wellbeing depends.

Oceans, marine waters, and marine resources are increasingly threatened, degraded, or destroyed by human activities, diminishing oceans capacity to deliver crucial ecosystem services.

To preserve the quality of life the oceans have provided for humanity, while maintaining the integrity of their ecosystems, changes in how humans perceive, manage, and utilize the oceans, seas, and marine resources, will be necessary.

The ocean helps local and global economies on an enormous scale, providing millions of jobs worldwide, particularly in developing countries. The ocean economy is particularly important in developing countries, where the majority of the three billion people that depend on the sea for livelihoods live.

Today’s guest knows all too well the impact we have on the ocean and the changes, big or small, that we need to make.

Mehgan Heaney-Grier is a pioneering free diver, ocean explorer and longtime conservationist. With more than 20 years of experience working both above and below the waterline. Mehgan has built a career as a professional speaker, marine educator, stunt diver, podcast host and television personality.

As an advocate, ocean explorer, and narrative-teller on a variety of media platforms, Mehgan is dedicated to raising awareness and equipping the next generation of ocean stewards to participate in and address the critical issues facing our oceans today.

In 1996, Mehgan made history by establishing the first US free dive record for both men and women in the constantly category. She has performed underwater stunts for Hollywood films such as Pirates of the Caribbean and into the blue, and has been featured in numerous television shows and publications worldwide such as Life, People and Outside Magazine.

Mehgan was recruited by Discovery Channel to be part of an elite team of explorers and starred in their original series treasure quest Snake Island.

Recently, Mehgan developed and launched an original web series called The Imperfect Conservationist and in the short video clips, Mehgan delivers a dose of what she likes to call conservation empowerment, giving bite sized and impactful ways to incorporate conservation action into your busy everyday life.

Christine loved hearing about Mehgan’s early days as a free diver, the sport and how her place in it has evolved and exploring her mission to embrace imperfection as we navigate conservation efforts so that we don't find ourselves stuck and not taking any action.

Join us now for this soulful conversation with Mehgan Heaney-Grier.

In this episode, Christine and Mehgan discuss:

Megan’s journey from actress to activist to philanthropist
How freediving has changed over the years
Why freediving is a way to connect with nature
The importance of ocean conservation and how to make a positive impact
How to not let the idea of being the perfect responsible traveller stop you from being an imperfect responsible traveller
What Megan wants to have in her life and work
Why we need to take what you’re already passionate about and amplify it

Resources & Links Mentioned in the Episode

Learn more about Mehgan, head over to https://www.mehganheaneygrier.com/

Subscribe and watch The Imperfect Conservationist on YouTube for your dose of conservation empowerment!

Follow on Instagram, Facebook, and LinkedIn

Join me for my Women’s Wilderness and Yoga Retreat in Alaska in March 2023!

We’ll be traveling 63 miles north of the Arctic Circle to stay at Arctic Hive, owned by my friend Mollie Busby and her husband Sean. This boutique property nestled in the Brooks Range is way off the beaten path and also off grid. We’ll stay in beautiful cabins built by hand by our hosts, practice yoga in their yoga dome lovingly referred to as The Hive, with gorgeous views of the surrounding nature.

We’ll explore the wilderness by snowshoe and dog sled, connect with members of the local community to learn about living in this remote environment, enjoy daily yoga practice and vegan meals all while keeping our eye out for the beautiful northern lights that like to show off their magic this time of year.

I only have 6 spaces for this unique adventure and a few are already taken. Hop over to the Lotus Sojourns website to book yours today.

Please share this experience with anyone you know would love this restorative adventure.

Want to learn more, you can listen to my Soul of Travel conversation, episode 67 with Mollie Busby

Visit www.lotussojourns.com/journeys to join this unique travel experience today.

To watch this interview on YouTube HERE.

Learn more about Lotus Sojourns

Looking for ways to be a part of the community, learn more here.

Find Lotus Sojourns on Facebook, or join the Lotus Sojourns Collective, our FB community for like-hearted women.

LOVE these conversations...support the production of this podcast by making a donation here!

Support the show (https://www.paypal.com/donate?hosted_button_id=Y76XFGFWCMEV8)

WE WON A BESSIE AWARD! The Bessie Awards recognize the achievements of women and gender-diverse people making an impact in the travel industry. To view the complete list of this year’s winners, visit bessieawards.org.

About the Soul Of Travel Podcast

Soul of Travel honors the passion and dedication of the people making a positive impact in tourism. In each episode, you’ll hear the story of women who are industry professionals and seasoned travelers and community leaders who know travel is more than a vacation. It is an opportunity for personal awareness and it is a vehicle for change. We are thought leaders, action takers, and heart-centered change makers.

The guests work in all sectors of the tourism industry. You'll hear from adventure-based community organizations, social impact businesses, travel photographers and videographers, tourism boards and destination marketing organizations, and transformational travel experts. They all honor the idea that travel is more than a vacation and focus on sustainable travel, eco-travel, community-based tourism, and intentional travel.

These conversations are meant to educate, inspire and create community. They are directed to new travelers and seasoned travelers, as well as industry professionals and those who are curious about a career in travel.

If you want to learn about new destinations, types of travel, or how to be more intentional or live life on purpose, join Christine Winebrenner Irick for soulful conversations with her community of fellow travelers exploring the heart, the mind, and the globe. These conversations highlight what tourism really means for the world.

Subscribe & Review on Apple Podcasts

Are you subscribed to the podcast? If you’re not, I want to encourage you to do that today so you don’t miss an episode.

Click here to subscribe to Apple Podcasts!

Credits. Christine Winebrenner Irick (Host, creator, editor.) Mehgan Heaney-Grier (Guest). Original music by Clark Adams. Editing and production by Rayna Booth.

Transcript

KEYWORDS

people, world, underwater, ocean, travel, feel, diving, conservation, environment, diver, life, talking, conversations, conservationist, explore, impact, snorkel, big, positive impact, traveler

Christine Winebrenner Irick 00:08

Thank you for joining me for soulful conversations with my community of fellow travelers, exploring the heart, the mind and the globe. These conversations highlight what travel really means for the world. Soul of Travel honors the passion and dedication of the people making a positive impact in tourism. Each week, I'll be speaking to women who are tourism professionals, world travelers and leaders in their communities will explore how travel has changed them and how that has rippled out and inspired them to change the world. These conversations are as much about travel as they are about passion, and living life with purpose, chasing dreams, building businesses, and having the desire to make the world a better place. This is a community of people who no travel is more than a vacation. It is an opportunity for personal awareness, and it is a vehicle for change. We are thought leaders, action takers, and heart centered change makers I'm Christine Winebrenner Irick. And this is the Soul of Travel.

Mehgan Heaney-Grier is a pioneering free diver Ocean Explorer and longtime conservationist. With more than 20 years of experience working both above and below the waterline. Mehgan has built a career as a professional speaker, marine educator, stunt diver, podcast host and television personality.

In 1996, Mehgan made history by establishing the first US free dive record for both men and women in the constant category. She has performed underwater stunts for Hollywood films such as Pirates of the Caribbean and into the blue, and has been featured in numerous television shows and publications worldwide such as life, people and Outside Magazine, Mehgan was recruited by Discovery Channel to be part of an elite team of explorers and starred in their original series treasure quest Snake Island.

Mehgan's passions come together in her work for the ocean as an advocate and storyteller, raising awareness and empowering the next generation of ocean stewards to engage and tackle the critical issues facing our oceans today. Recently, Mehgan developed and launched an original web series called The imperfect conservationist and the short video clips, Mehgan delivers a dose of what she likes to call conservation empowerment, giving bite sized and impactful ways to incorporate conservation action into busy everyday life. I loved hearing about her early days as a free diver and how the sport and her place in it have evolved and exploring her mission to embrace imperfection as we navigate conservation efforts so that we don't find ourselves stuck and not taking any action.

Join me now for my soulful conversation with Mehgan Heaney-Grier.

Welcome to soul of travel podcast I'm so excited today to be sitting down with Mehgan Heaney-Grier, who is a pioneering freediver Ocean Explorer and conservationist, she set the first US freedive record for both men and women and has worked in Hollywood as an underwater stunt performer. So we are going to get to talk about some really fun things today that I'm so excited to bring to the podcast. So welcome, Mehgan.

03:48

Thank you. Thanks for having me on. Good to be here.

Christine Winebrenner Irick 03:51

Well, I was gonna say we should dive right in, which is what I always say, but it's never been done before.

03:57

To teach. Oh, good. I love that one.

Christine Winebrenner Irick 04:01

So I would love to give you a moment just to quickly introduce yourself. So my audience knows who they're listening to. And then we'll move on from there.

04:11

Yeah, absolutely. Well, you did a very good job. You're so yourself introducing me. So I don't know what else I need to say. But yeah, my name is Mehgan. I'm a freediver. A very old school freediver. I will say way before it was more mainstream, like it is now. And I also very much consider myself a Explorer One . I have a very well honed wanderlust and yeah, I'm a mama bear and I love what else I'm an imperfect conservationist.

That's kind of the main header that I've been doing a lot of my work under lately, and we can talk more about that coming up. But I yeah, all of my advice. insurers in freediving and my deepwater routes have kind of come full circle to be coming in as an ocean advocate, working in outreach and impact and just helping, you know, speak for the ocean and elevate the messaging of what we all can do, even when we can feel so helpless in the face of the big issues we're facing today. So with the environments and ocean,

Christine Winebrenner Irick 05:21

I love the idea of being an imperfect conservationist. That's actually what brought us together, Kinga Phillips was on my podcast, we were talking a little bit about the intimidation factor when you're talking about conservation or looking at these bigger issues. And she said, Oh, you have to talk to my friend who is literally an imperfect conservationist. So Kinga for the connection. Thank you Kinga. Well, to get to know a little bit more about you, I would love to get to understand kind of when you first felt that wanderlust, and that connection to the sea and when it started to become an important part of your life.

06:00

Yeah, absolutely. So my, let's see, My story began by a totally different large body of water. I was born in Duluth, Minnesota, which is right on the point of Lake Superior. And so when I was around 10, my family moved, my mom remarried, and my family moved down to the Florida Keys, which is really where the ocean story starts. For me, we had visited the ocean, but you know, being a kid from Minnesota, like the North Woods, and creeks and streams, and all those things were very much ingrained in me and my default environment.

And then when I got down to the keys, and we're living on this rock in the middle of the ocean, and you know, the front yard is the Atlantic Ocean in the backyard, so to speak, is the Gulf of Mexico, my default environment that was like a 180. You know, it's warm all year, when my mom would shoot us out of the house after chores or homework, or whatever was done like when your kids go out and play like it took on a whole different meaning. So I'm out, you know, crawling through the mangrove forests and seeing alligators and saltwater Crocs and doing it, you know, just like all this, this different environment to explore and, and soak in.

And I mean, the underwater world was like stepping into avatar, you know, where everything was alien to me, I had no idea what any of the creatures and all this the colors and all of that were and so it was such a neat, neat way to branch out my environment and you know, really my interest and and affinity for travel and, and the my wanderlust in that way, my mom always traveled so she was a big traveler, and a lot of times she would take my sister and I with her, but she would always do even when we lived in Minnesota, she would always go on like, with her best friend down. And it's funny. So this trip is how I ended.

Uh, well, I mean, obviously, okay, travels, how I ended up at the ocean, obviously. But this is so interesting. My mom was on a girls trip from Minnesota with her best friend down. Now it's a popular destination to go. But she was down there in Eastland Harris, which is a little island off of Cancun, Mexico, and it was not a tourist destination at all back then. And that's where she met me, my stepdad, her husband, my gosh, like 36 years ago, whatever it was. And that's how we ended up in the Florida Keys. So she was coming from Duluth, Minnesota, he had sailed over from the Florida Keys with his salty crew, you know, and they met on the beach, randomly in a non tourist destination at that point. So that is how I ended up so you know, that kind of unique twist of fate down in the Florida Keys. And that set the trajectory for my whole life of what I'm passionate about finding my purpose in life, and all of it and being an ocean advocate.

Christine Winebrenner Irick 09:02

Yeah, but so amazing, because I think it's fun to reflect like, I love having these conversations. When people have that moment. They're like, we never thought about it in that way or noticed it. But it's so amazing the pieces that fall into place to get us where we are. And when you really start thinking about the sliding door that could have happened. Yes. And all these things would be different. And maybe you would still be like this part of me and I don't know what it is. But I live you know, in a different part of the Midwest and I'm just not feeling fulfilled right that mechanism to happen. But that's so amazing. Thank you for sharing that when I was talking about the contrast between coming from you know, having Lake and forest in your backyard to having the ocean.

I was thinking about how I grew up in Montana and then I don't know, probably when I was in my late 20s went to Belize for a month and got certified to scuba dive Hmm. And there's something like, you can go to the rainforest. And the animals and the trees and everything are different, but not like so far and like you have some context, even though you've never seen a monkey or scarlet Macaw. But it still doesn't feel so alien. And then you go under that water. And you like you said, it is like Avatar, it's like, what is down here? And it also feels like anything could be down here.

And yeah, when you're hiking, you just don't get that same sense. I'm not like, it's such a different way that you feel in that space. And so it's like, really freeing and on spiring. And a little bit terrifying, because yeah, you can't really wrap our minds around how big things are and how deep things go. And I'm sure you've spent so much more time in the water. Now you have a greater sense of that. But it is such a mystical place

10:56

to be. Oh, absolutely. Yeah, I mean, we have outer space, right. And then it really truly is our inner space. And just to think about, you know, we've explored so much of the universe and outer space. But we've explored more of that than our actual underwater world. It's just as incredible when you start thinking about actual space that we are on our own blue planet that we haven't even explored yet. And so you know, we're making headway and all of that with the different submersibles and the ROV and all this stuff. But it is pretty incredible to think about it in that context. Because like outer space, right? It's just becoming the idea of being accessible to average people like ourselves to go into outer space, which I have no interest in doing, but man, I feel 100% at home underwater.

Christine Winebrenner Irick 11:47

Yeah, it is. It is so different. And that's such a good comparison as well. Well, I would love to hear how then you went from kind of exploring your own backyard to freediving and when did that become a part of your journey?

12:01

Sure. So like I said, it was really our default environment growing up. Once we got down to the keys, we spent our free time in the water out sailing. We had Luke key which is part of the National Marine Sanctuary right off of when I grew up on Summerland key. So it's kind of right in between the two ones that people know pretty well are Key West and marathon. And so Summerland is like smack dab in the middle of considering it kind of the country of the Florida Keys, the countryside, because we're not, not in the big city of Key West as much as you would call it that.

But yeah, so we would go out to the reef, and, you know, go on sailing trips, for our vacations and things like that. And I guess, you know, just spending so much time in the water I really talked to it's really funny, because my sister, she moved back to Minnesota, literally the day after she graduated high school, she went to college up there, she still lives up there really just didn't take to the water in the same way I did. And so we both had that environment. But I just felt like I had come home.

And I loved spending all of my time underwater. And then when I graduated high school, I took some time off and went back to school and was modeling in Miami Beach and would come home and spend a lot of time still. And I would just be out on the water all the time, because I had all that time freed up that I wasn't in school. And from there, when I got into freediving, it was very, it's not what it is today. And for anybody who may not know what freediving is. It's breath hold diving. So the competitive side of freediving is basically how deep you can go on one breath of air. And the category that I started competing in was called Qatar is called constant weight. And so just like it sounds, whatever weight you bring down, you have to bring back up with you. And so back then, however, it was very much it was very obscure, I was compared to Evil Knievel all the time, it was considered a daredevil stunts and all this and it just came so far.

Now you can get a certification in freediving through one of the major agencies, certification agencies and some of the small or most of the small ones as well. And the thing is, is, you know, I was spending all the time out on the water. I've stumbled across a couple of really basic techniques, like don't look at the bottom, take a couple extra breaths, and start free falling after a certain point. So you're not wasting your energy, that type of thing, really basic stuff. And I was out on a spear fishing trip with a couple buddies of mine. And I had borrowed a depth meter watch. And so I was like, Oh, well, let me see how deep I can go with these little tricks I learned. And I did at seven feet on my first try. And then, you know, I was kind of looking at my depth meter watch when I was down there and I'm like, Whoa, I have definitely not been this deep.

And so I should maybe go back up, so I went back up, and then I did 120 feet on my next dive. And so I was like, wow. Okay, so I loved freediving, I wanted to spend all of my time now, even more underwater. And, you know, I, I just wanted to try and figure out how deep I could go, like, push my own limits. And I was at the time I was 18. And just, you know, it was so exciting to find something that I was so passionate about at that young age, and just literally pour all of my energy into that, and we came up with

15:38

This is way back in the mid 90s. And there was no, you know, internet, we certainly wouldn't be chatting with each other on, you know, zoom and recording and doing all this stuff in this fashion way back then. So I did my research at the library and found out that there was no US record in the constant weight category ever set. So in 96, I established that first record, the US constant weight record for men and women, and with a dive to 155 feet, and then a little less than a year later, I bettered that record to 165 feet. And so really, I mean, people have gone so much deeper now. And, you know, it's like I said, it's really evolved over the last couple of decades, to where it's a mainstream sport and a way to, you know, connect with the ocean. And there's competitions all year round all over the world. And it's really exciting to see how much it's changed and grown.

And like I said, people go so much deeper now. But my claim to fame is that I got on in that trailblazing ground level and in establishing that first record, and helped kind of kick it off, especially here in the United States. Because, you know, freediving itself has been a means of hunting for spearfishing, and a way of collecting food and things like that. And the ALMA divers, in Japan, you know, are the pearl divers. So it's been utilized in that way, internationally for hundreds of years. But it is as far as being a sport. It's very young and very, very young here in the United States. So it's been exciting watching it grow and change over time.

Christine Winebrenner Irick 17:21

Yeah. Well, then I think to myself, I'm just imagining the difference between what it looks like to do it today, when there are parameters and education and resources and where you're like this 18 year old girl with your buddies, and you're like, Oh, let's see what could happen. Let's see what we can do. Yeah,

17:39

I mean, it literally was trial and error, you know, and there's me and it can be very, very dangerous. Yeah, you know, and we, we didn't really know. So we had some close calls, you know, I pulled my coach up off the bottom of the pool, which was just my friends. You know, like, my coach, I had a couple coaches that we just all started training together. And it was, but yeah, it was very homegrown, very trial and error. I mean, I would tow the boat with a rope around my waist, you know, to get to exercise and get my legs in a state of lactic acid and try and work through that. And, I pushed the car for two miles. And I mean, it was like, you know, we were mixing top side sports training with apnea, you know, and being in a state of breath hold.

So it was just kind of this combination, taking what we did know, from sports, training topside, and then combining it with this kind of new realm of freediving. See, see what could happen. You know, it was a very, very exciting time. I mean, it's hard. It's hard, you know, even in our lifetimes to do something for the first time for something that's new, you know, that hasn't been done before. And I am incredibly thankful, you know, I think about the young woman I was then and I'm like, wait a go, lady. Like, that's so I mean, um, because you know, what you can kind of have that, like, and this is the same with travel to, where you can almost have that it's you, you look back, but it's this out, it's almost like this out of body, you know, it's like you have a separation.

Enough time goes by and you have this separation, and you look back at trips you did in your, you know, in your early life as a kid or then in your 20s like you were talking about and beliefs and just all this stuff. And it's really similar in that way. It's like I can look back. And just, sometimes I try to channel her energy, you know, I'm like, man, if I'm because you change so much over the course of your life and you have different responsibilities and obligations. And it's like, what you often hear like, oh, what would you tell your younger self? And I'm like, Whoa, She told me, right what advice could I get from her and try it? And it's in there, right? Because it is you.

And so trying to go back to that point, when it's this, thinking about it with wanderlust and travel and just the the guts you have as a young person in that way, you know, throwing caution to the wind, and you're not worrying about like, you're literally feel invincible. And trying to channel that sometimes I'm like, Man, I want to bottle that.

Christine Winebrenner Irick 20:30

Yes, I agree. And I'll tell a story about a travel experience I had when I was younger, you know, to someone I know. Now, the first thing is they look at me, like, there's no possible way that that's the same person that you are today. Right? And then I like to look at them. And I almost want to agree. I'm like, Oh, wait, no, that must have been a book I read. You're right. That wasn't me. Yeah. And then yeah, that freedom you have when you're younger, because you don't have the same responsibilities.

And you don't have the same understanding of risk and consequence. But it does allow you to just really, like just like, go and be a part of something like that. And it's so amazing. And I agree, like, it would be very interesting to hear, like your internal thoughts from that point in time and relate to that and see how you could pull it into this life.

But also, I think, as a mother, this is something for me with diving, even after I had kids, I cannot put my head back under the water. And so crazy. I have tried a couple of times, really. And it's just like every mama Sal is like an unnecessary risk. Like you can't breathe underwater, and you have three children. And I'm like, oh, but it's fine. Like I was even in Bali. And it was like clear blue water. Let's see to the, like, perfect, you know, like diving in the swimming pool, essentially. And just me and one other person at a dive master, like, all of these perfect things. And I tried for like 15 minutes, and I just was like crying and I was like, I don't think I'm a diver anymore. I think I've done this. Maybe I can get back to it. But it's just interesting.

Like, whoever that version of me. Yeah, I was like, I'm just a different person now. So yeah, it's so interesting, just how do we evolve?

22:23

Yeah, yeah, I mean, I definitely made some changes as well, but definitely not with diving. So I hope you can get back to it too. Because pi is so amazing. But now I take my son freediving with me, which is really, really awesome. Going actually here. This is the picture of when he was first snorkeling before he could swim. So here he was, I was showing him how to do his math that sound in the keys. But I love that, you know, just exposing him to that realm underwater as well. It's been really, it's almost like, I get to see it for the first time again, you know, because I see his face and I see his his eyes and he if you speak snorkel, you know, like he's talking to me through snore like, or just, it's just so cool. And he's sometimes he's in well, a lot of times he's in when I'm not in, I'll get waterlogged. And I'm like, oh, I want to go sit and you know, soak up the song, so I get cold or whatever. And he'll be out there and he's singing through a snorkel and he's zero. So I hope you get back to it. Especially with any Oceanside adventures you have coming up and your next big travels.

Christine Winebrenner Irick 23:36

Yeah, no, I think we'll at least be snorkeling. But maybe the diving will come back when I can feel that comfort with them.

23:43

Yeah, so you're okay snorkeling? Still just not diving? Oh, well, that's yeah, I mean, I prefer anyway, obviously free diving, I've been deeper freediving than I have scuba diving. But here's the thing. What changed for me along the lines, like I was competitive 96 and 97. And then in 1998, I assembled and captained the very first US freedive team to compete in the World Cup. And that was really exciting. But it also was really educational for me, bringing all of the people together all these free divers together was incredibly exhilarating. You know, and watching people dive and and just seeing the process and all of that and I was 20 You know, and what I learned was about myself that I really didn't like the competitive side of it.

I liked competing against myself. I liked pushing my own limits, seeing what I could do. But even that started becoming more like I don't know, it felt like it felt like work and this was my zone of like where I went to be at peace. I've never really been good at yoga or meditation or really stopping you know, and freediving forces you to be Hey, we were talking about it a little bit earlier, but like forces you to be present in that very moment.

Because you have to be and I love that and it's so it's kind of like my, my spiritual zone that I love to do. And those things weren't meshing for me where it was like, oh, deeper and, and, you know, the egos involved and all of that stuff and so I for me freediving turned into, or maybe I just got back to this desire to just connect with the environment and be so it's more about bottom time and being able to go in there and relax so, so I prefer freediving and you know snorkeling and just skin diving and that type of thing anyway over over the rest. And it really is such a great conduit into conservation, you know, where you're where you're connecting with the environment in such a different way.

There's no noisy bubbles, there's none of that. And you can just like, be this, this visitor hanging out resting on the bottom and the creatures get curious about you. And they kind of come out from where they are and investigate you and what you are doing, you know, and then they just, if you're there long enough, they just get back about their business. And it's so cool. And, and it does connect you in that way where it's like, okay, this, this place is part of my story, this place is part of me. And I want to protect it now because it's part of me. And that's kind of where all of my my fuel for conservation comes from, I would say to

Christine Winebrenner Irick 26:31

Yeah, well, that was a great segue. Because my next question is, you know, really, after you've had the privilege of exploring, and you've been able to see the ocean, like all around the world, so you you are starting to understand like, what healthy ocean looks like and healthy environment looks like and and now that is like you said a part of your story. How did that lead into conservation and then eventually into and be imperfect conservationist?

26:56

Yeah, so it was really, you know, my journey with conservation started, I would say, very young, I just didn't recognize it in that way. All those years ago, but

27:11

Really, there was a time where I was working a lot with sharks and alligators. And we were doing all sorts of, you know, basically experimental freediving with these creatures. It was, we were documenting our encounters with them. And we were doing a lot of this in the mid 90s. Again. So we were doing a lot of hands-on work with the animals, which evolved so much for me. I've changed so much that I don't utilize the hands-on method with really anything out in nature anymore.

But it's, you know, our understanding of conservation has changed a lot. Collectively, thank goodness and also our understanding of predators. an important role in the ecosystem has evolved so much since the mid 90s. So if you're thinking back to that time, you know, it was very much a killer be killed mentality. That was kind of the prevailing mentality out on the water. And with alligators, you know, it's like, the footage we were collecting from our encounters, we ended up having my buddies and I, we had a show on Animal Planet back then. And it came out in 1999, which was the same year the Crocodile Hunter came out, which he was very hands on to and it was this at the time, this good counterbalance.

Like I was saying to that mentality, where it's like, promoting coexistence because you don't need to kill it just because it's there. Because it, you know, is perceived as being really dangerous, or we don't understand its full role in the ecosystem yet at this point, but, you know, it's, it's, it's like, Hey, we're down here, you know, we're doing this this cutting edge trailblazing work with the animals. We had no weapons, we had no protection. We weren't diving with chainmail or cages or anything like that, or even tanks because we were free diving.

And a lot of the, you know, a lot of the methods used for conservation with the animals and things like that today are in part based on the work that we were doing then. So there's a lot of rescue that goes on with alligators and crocodiles. And there's a lot of wildlife photography that goes on now, which was not being done in that way where we were free diving in the swamp with these alligators going up to them and seeing what we could do and saying, hey, you know, they're indifferent to us.

At best I understood. The way this ties into my conservation work is that I understood with all of the changes I was seeing take place underwater with the reefs, with the encounters with the predators I was seeing that we had a huge impact on their world. And I also was seeing that just about everything we thought we understood about these animals was 100%. Wrong. So what else were we getting wrong?

You know, and I was at that time, I was like, Okay, wait, so let's change how we're viewing these predators, let's let's try and collectively like, shift the, you know, move that needle, to where we get to bring the stories back, you know, not everybody had an iPhone in their pocket at that time that technology did not exist. So we were, we were bringing stories back from underwater, through the footage we were collecting, we got the show on Animal Planet, promoting coexistence and conservation from those stories.

And then throughout time, you know, I continue to see the underwater world and the reefs in particular degrade, you know, with climate change, and the increasing temperature of the water and coral bleaching and plastic pollution and all of these things really started just coming to a just coming right in front of your, you know, your your Ford, they were really brought to the forefront.

That's what I'm trying to say they were just, you know, you could not go out on the boat and not see a stream of plastic, having worked its way into the seaweed lines and things like that. And so then it started, you know, I was getting invited to do public speaking, I do a lot of public speaking. And I was getting invited to come speak in different venues, whether it be school or you know, the Explorers Club or wherever, just talk about my stories in the water and talk about my freediving and the animal work and, and stump diving, eventually I got into for Hollywood and television and things like that. And so I was invited to talk about these things. And it became very clear to me that the real part of the story is what's changing underwater. And maybe you haven't gotten to see this, and this is the problem that we're having. But then it was like, you can't stop there.

Right? You can't just leave, you can't pull on everybody's hearts, strings and like crack them open, ready to go, oh, well, what can I do? And then not have an answer? Because once you're aware of the problems, it's really important to understand the problems going on in the environment, but you can't get stuck there, you know, because that is so depressing. For one. And it can be really debilitating, where you just feel paralyzed, like, Oh, my God is too big, I can't do anything. So where do you take it from there? Where do you go? The way that you know, this is kind of the evolution through time where I was like, okay, so we need some tools, I need tools, I know I'm a solution based thinker. And that's where we need to take, you know, the problems we have. And we need to take it to the solutions.

And a lot of that's happening. You know, when when you think about conservation, a lot of what we do is we go oh, there's these huge, you know, NGOs and the you know, the nonprofit organizations tackling things you hear about like organizations like for ocean and for each, you know, item you buy from them with the bracelets and the different things that they have, they take a pound of ocean trash, or they take a pound of trash out of the ocean. And you know, so you hear about these big things that you maybe see what the work Sea Shepherd is doing, where they're out, you know, fighting the whaling ships and things like that, but not everybody can just up and and start an organization or a global movement, like Greta Thun Berg, or all of this work is so important, but it's not necessarily within everybody's grasp to do so we have this big problems, and we see these big solutions happening and and with what I was experiencing, personally, I was overwhelmed with all of that. I'm like, you know, can I donate?

Or how can I be involved, and it just felt like it even though it was important, and of course it is, it felt like it wasn't really doing much, and I'm still having an impact in my daily life. And then I was starting to feel really depressed and sad about that. And that's like a total rabbit hole, you can go down. And, you know, I was thinking, Well, what do I do? You know, everything seems so small and insignificant. And then I started looking around at my life and I'm like, Okay, well, I bring my water bottle everywhere. And then I'm like, Okay, well, that's one thing. Is that going to change the world?

No, but I actually feel pretty good doing that. And I was like, Okay, well, and I use my reusable bags when I remember him at the store, or to bring him to the store. Is that making a difference? And I'm like, what, I feel better when I do that. And so then I started looking around and it dawned on me that the whole point is that these small, insignificant things by themselves don't maybe really mean that much. But when I add them up collectively in my day to day life, it matters to me. It makes matters to my kid. It matters to people that I've seen at the grocery store that I don't know that I call it car bagging. One time it dawned on me there, I was, like, I forgot my bags again, because oh my god, everybody forgets their bags right in the car. And I was like, I'm just gonna bag in the car. So now I have a car bag, and I've been stopped multiple times, by people I don't know. And they're like, oh my god, I never thought of that.

That's a great idea. And then I get back this proof, positive impact to me that the little seemingly insignificant things I do make a difference to my immediate environment, maybe to the people around me to my life, my kids life, and bettering you know, the community here. And that's how this ripples out. So, through little steps, like that is where this brand, the imperfect conservationist was born. Because I'm like, man, we cannot do it all. And you and I were earlier talking about this, this, you know, perfectionism paralyzation, that we can get where it's like, oh, I have got to do it all and it's got to be perfect, or it doesn't make a damn bit of difference.

And it's just not true, it's not the case. And when we make a difference in our own lives, that is, so empowering. So I like to call it conservation empowerment. And that is really my message that I bring to, you know, groups that I go and speak with, and a program that I'm developing, as far as a workshop, to really just empower myself and my kid and my friends and all of us to make these little changes. Because when, when we make small changes, and we bake them into our everyday life, they become a habit, they become sustainable. And so, you know, I started looking around, like I said, in my life just going okay, so I'm busy, I'm a single mom, we're all busy, right? Like, I'm an entrepreneur, I'm going in a million directions, it feels like at all times, and I still try and do self care, so that I can show up for my kid and, and all of these things and be the best version of me that I can be.

And when I think about making changes, it's just like, Oh, it's another thing to add to my to do list, even if it's like, you know, take takes an extra 10 minutes, it's like, yeah, along with the other 40 thing isn't doing you know, and so it's in the criteria that it has to meet. For me to try and make a change in my life for the environment, for the ocean, these places that I feel part of is that it has to be easy, it has to be affordable, and it has to make an impact. Because I don't want it to just get lost, you know, in the fray, and diluted in that way. And I think when we pick things, pick our battles, when we pick our battles,